The Garden State Outdoorsmen Podcast
Welcome to the Garden State Outdoorsmen Podcast, the ultimate New Jersey podcast for outdoor enthusiasts! Presented by Boondocks Hunting, we dive deep into the world of hunting, fishing, conservation, and everything that makes the Garden State a unique outdoor haven. Join us as we explore local hotspots, interview seasoned experts, share hunting tips and tactics, and discuss the latest in outdoor gear and regulations. Whether you’re a seasoned outdoorsman or new to the wild, our episodes bring you closer to New Jersey’s rich outdoor culture and community. Tune in and get ready to chase the unknown!
The Garden State Outdoorsmen Podcast
The Pursuit of Public Land Turkey w/ Nj Woodlander
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Hey, what's going on everybody? Frank Mastica from the Garden State Outdoorsman Podcast. I just wanted to hop on here real quick and apologize, but due to technical difficulties we had to cut the podcast short. With Mike Testa from NJ Woodlander on Instagram, we look forward to having him back on again, but for now we hope you guys enjoy this episode and we'll see you guys next time.
Speaker 2:Welcome back to the Garden State Outdoorsman Podcast presented by Boone Ducks Hunting.
Speaker 1:That's why your tagline, my JCL known perfect. You don't know what that mountain's going to bring.
Speaker 2:You don't know what that mountain's going to bring I accidentally drifted my canoe between a sow and a cub and she, like charged and like hit, like the back of the canoe.
Speaker 3:His head hit the ground before his ass did.
Speaker 2:Begging, begging and crying. To go with my grandfather, go with my father on these deer drives.
Speaker 3:You know, the last trip over I shot a great cape buffalo with my bow, charging through the grass, and then the whooping and then you hear a body drop. Welcome everybody to the Garden State Outdoorsman Podcast. I'm your host, Frank Mestica.
Speaker 2:I'm your co-host, Mike Nightrang.
Speaker 3:And ladies and gentlemen, today we got a very special guest. He goes by New Jersey Woodlander on Instagram, mr Mike Testa testa.
Speaker 4:mike, welcome to the show thank you guys for having me man.
Speaker 3:I really appreciate it, really appreciate it very much no, we appreciate you having you on so, mike, why don't you just give us a a quick breakdown of, um, you know, just a little background on yourself, like it could be family, whatever, whatever, wherever you want to start, absolutely man.
Speaker 4:So I am uh 46. I lived in New Jersey my whole life, hunted fish in New Jersey my whole life. Um, from Northern, I'm from North Jersey originally, but I live in uh, central Southern New Jersey Now. Um, I work in agriculture and, you know, just literally tore up with turkeys and I love to trout fish, shed, hunt, all that type of stuff, man. So so just just love being in the outdoors, Jim, and yeah, no, that's definitely awesome.
Speaker 3:Yeah so, mike. So I was just going to ask you real quick about um. So you say you're into agriculture. For people who, like, don't really know too much about it, can you like dive in a little bit more about it?
Speaker 4:absolutely, yeah, yeah. So I'm really lucky. I get to travel, uh from sussex county to cape may county pretty much every week. I'm in the field all the time um. I work um pretty much on farms, helping farmers uh, being able to sell their produce to a lot of the bigger grocery stores in the state of new jersey. So your wagmans, your weight ferns, all that kind of stuff, so it's really cool. Also Also helps me to you know, see a lot of wildlife, know where a lot of stuff is going on in the state.
Speaker 4:You know, one morning I could be up in High Point, and you know, on a Monday morning and then on Tuesday morning I might be down in Cape May County. So you know, literally all over the state. So it's it's a pretty cool job, there's no doubt about that whatsoever. Wow, yeah, I think I might be a little jealous yeah.
Speaker 3:You know you get to work and scout. Yeah, get to work and scout all at the same time.
Speaker 4:Love it. Like I said, I'm hyping it up a little bit, but I got.
Speaker 3:I am very lucky, there's no doubt about that.
Speaker 4:All right, we'll take it.
Speaker 3:Yep, yep that's exactly right, man. Awesome, awesome. So you must be getting excited for turkey season coming up. What's your plans for that?
Speaker 4:100%. So I got a B week and C week tag down here in the south. And then for a week I'm going to a turkey camp in Pennsylvania. So I'll be out in Pennsylvania for the opener and then work that BNC weekend with work and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 4:So, super, super pumped up about that. Absolutely I was gonna. My plan was also to head down to Maryland but I just think you know, with family and all that kind of stuff, I don't think that's going to work this year. But definitely, definitely hunting those two states Jersey and I go to Pennsylvania every year.
Speaker 3:Wow, that's awesome. Now do you got private land in Pennsylvania or you hunt state land, so in Pennsylvania.
Speaker 4:We hunt both private and public. Primarily public, but we do have permission to get on some ground and where we hunt at, which is really pretty cool.
Speaker 3:No, that's really cool. I've never hunted PA for basically turkey or really deer lately, but I used to go out there a lot and hunt doves a lot when. I was a kid with my family.
Speaker 4:Absolutely yeah, yeah yeah. At Delaware to hunt doves is crazy, right? So kid with my family, absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah that Delaware to hunt doves is crazy, right? So it's got to go yeah, it was.
Speaker 3:Oh, we used to have a blast, I think I.
Speaker 4:I used to go through like a hundred shells as a kid, like nothing oh man, if you think you're a good shot, hunt doves, right, then you're like oh my god yep 100 100 now plus that season kind of kicks off your year, you know, like the september yeah you're like oh man, now we're, we're rocking and rolling. Now you know what I mean. That's absolutely. That's awesome.
Speaker 3:That's really cool no, that is really cool. So I know um. So you said that you got um. You said cnd week for jersey uh, cnd, that's right yeah cnd all right. So what's your plans for jersey then?
Speaker 4:because do you hunt land in jersey 100 public ground in new jersey. Yeah, I, I, I have. All my hunting is on public ground in new jersey. Yeah, yeah, absolutely 100. So that's why I kind of you know I'm one of those guys that just has boots on the ground all the time. I love being in the woods regardless. So it's as you guys know, it's has boots on the ground all the time I love being in the woods regardless.
Speaker 4:So it's as you guys know, it's a grind on the public, especially down here, because in the Southern part of the state we have a lot of birds on our public ground, but everyone knows it you know what I mean Cause they're very, they're very noticeable. So you got to find, you got to find those little niche spots where you know that Monday morning when you go there, there's not going to be seven trucks parked in the same parking lot. You know what I mean. It's rough down here in the South Zones, like I said, there's a lot of birds. Our bird numbers are really good. The past two years, last year down here we had a phenomenal hatch.
Speaker 4:So, there's lots and lots and lots of birds down here.
Speaker 2:But, like I said, I'm not the only one seeing them. You know what I mean. That's yep. Quick question on on you know you're you're doing a cnd? Is this like a? Do you usually do later in the year because of your work schedule and everything like that, or is this just a year that you're you're deciding to do cnd? Okay?
Speaker 4:that's exactly what I do, and and what I found is that, um, as far where I hunt, the ground that I hunt, the birds are way more. They're still in those. You know. They're still tending birds down here, hens really late, I don't know why, but they're really with hens.
Speaker 4:So I give them that little bit of time to break up, get away from those hens and and, uh, you know, I, I, I seem to have more luck there in that regards like that, they're, uh, you know that a week they're still really henned up and you know, they're just, they're just. They got that one thing on their mind and they don't really want to leave those hens. You know what I mean. They're if they're with hens, they're.
Speaker 2:Kind of what's your strategy? Going into a hunt like that where you're hunting C&D? Obviously it's going to be a bit different than you know, getting a chance to hunt the first week and opening day and everything like that. So these are going to be pressure birds on, you know, public land. So what's your strategy? Going into a C&D week to start out?
Speaker 4:Yep, so I'm not an aggressive caller. I like to try to find birds, try to roost birds the night before, like Sunday night, before that Monday that I have time allowed to hunt. You know I'll hit a bunch of spots but I'm not like a really aggressive caller. I like to kind of let the birds do what they're going to do first when they come down off the roost. And you know I'll give them a couple, couple kiki's when they're on the um, when they're on the limb, just to let them know that I'm in the area, like a hen's in the area, um, but I'm not a very aggressive caller until they hit the ground. Um, most of my spots, most of the public ground that I hunt I'm not really hunting field birds at all um, it's all like bigger timber areas, um, so I like to find uh habitat breaks in in habitat breaks in those woodlands, like I hunt the pine barrens all the time which are pretty just monotonous, straight pitch pine mixed with blackjack oak and in those spots I try to.
Speaker 4:You know, a lot of the birds are found in specific areas of those big woods and you got to kind of find where they are in those breaks, those habitat breaks um, and then just try to really get yourself in a position where you're going to have open shots and they're going to be able to get to you. That's also an issue where I hunt. A lot of the areas are so thick so you really gotta kind of know where you're getting to get yourself a shot and get yourself, you know, situated where those birds can kind of make it to you at the same time.
Speaker 3:You know yeah, no, I think that's a really cool strategy actually, because I know, especially up um, up here in northern jersey where I live, it's uh, a lot of guys rely mostly on, like, the field edges. Absolutely, you know, you you might find one or two guys that hunt, you know, like in the woods, but mainly you, I mean you'll drive by a field and you'll just see decoys everywhere absolutely, man.
Speaker 4:Yes, yep, yep, absolutely. Like I said, we have, uh, you know, let's say I'm driving for work, I might see, honestly, like like a couple weeks ago, I'll probably see 40 to 50 birds in like a two-hour span, and on private, you know what I mean. So you know how lots of field birds down here, but, um, where I hunt, like I said, where I hunt, where I, where I have the access to I'm only hunting, you know, woodland birds definitely, definitely woodland setups like that, you know. So, like I said, I'm not very aggressive because a lot of times those birds are bumped and harassed on that eight week already.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean right but the cool thing is is a lot of people really only hunt three or four days you know what I mean and they're like, oh my god, I can't kill these birds, these birds, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:They're doing whatever they're doing, you know.
Speaker 4:So I kind of let everything almost settle down. You know what I I mean. And then you know, take my time, A lot of times I'll kill a bird, like at the end of the week. You know what I mean. Like once I can, once I can get in there and figure out what they're actually doing. You know what I mean. That's like, like I said, I, I, a couple of my buddies, are the running gun type of guys you know what I mean and I'm just it's.
Speaker 3:It's just what works for me and how I kind of learn to hunt the birds. You know what I mean? Just I take a like a, a common approach to to try to figure them out, right? No, I, because that's the approach I used last year. I did a lot of running, gunning and, um, I wasn't that successful with it but um, you know it's yeah, exactly so.
Speaker 3:I usually for me, especially for Jersey, I'll just, I'll usually just get like Y week. I'll just do Saturdays only, you know, here for Jersey, and then once New York state opens up, we have we have a farm up there I'll go up there, I'll get like with one of our other buddies from the Boondocks hunting crew and, uh, you know, I'll just hunt with him if I'm, if I want to go outdoor in the week, or you know, or on a Sunday or whatever but I'll just I mainly just focus on the Saturdays here.
Speaker 3:Yeah, um, you know, and I mean really, cause where I hunt it's the refuge itself. It's just it's hard because there's not a lot of. You know, I drove it actually the other day and I saw like maybe I saw one spot that was like six or eight birds and nothing else anywhere else. It's just it's just so overgrown and there's the habitat just not there for them absolutely, man, absolutely.
Speaker 4:There's no, no doubt about that. I know, like you know, we lost our fall season. Um, you know, they got rid of the fall season now, so we can't hunt birds in the fall and I'm all for you know, if somebody told me we can't hunt turkeys anymore, I'm I'm a person that's for the resource 100.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean. Like if, if the biologist said, you know our numbers are so low we have to have a three-year period where we can't hunt birds, I'm 100% not a peep out of it. So I'm fortunate enough to be on a lot of good farms with a lot of great habitat.
Speaker 4:Some of the farmers that I get permission to go on their property for work are doing a lot of work with a small game in the southern part of the state for northern boblets pretty much that's what a lot of the lot of the farmers are getting on NRCS money from the feds to do a lot of habitat improvements on their marginal ground and stuff. You know, and where they're doing that, I mean the pulp production, is amazing. You know what I mean. So, as you guys were saying, you know the public ground up north, the public ground near me in the central and southern part of the states, you know it leaves a lot, lot, lot to be desired. You know, and I'm very lucky to hunt in Pennsylvania where the game commission in Pennsylvania really does tremendous, tremendous amount of habitat work on the properties and you know you just have to cross the river to see the difference in, you know, habitat enhancement, habitat improvements, all those types of things. You know it's really it's it's it's pretty stark. You know what I mean.
Speaker 4:Um, when you see producers in like salem and cumberland, county new jersey, that are doing a lot of habitat work and then they they have bought public ground and you know all the all the wildlife, all the endangered species, all that kind of stuff is on their property and the state ground is, you know, pretty much just multi-flora rows and lots of invasive species and that kind of stuff. You know what I mean. It's, it's, you know pretty much just multi-flora rows and lots of invasive species and that kind of stuff. You know I mean, it's, it's, you know, you can.
Speaker 2:You can see it clear as day yeah, definitely go ahead, mike and that's something that I've definitely noticed and like at least some of the the wma's up by us have been doing a much better job at, at doing but like it was getting so bad, especially in west jersey, like you know, and you could see the turkey numbers declining for for many reasons and you know, yeah, they, they would probably be more on public and every or private and everything like that, but the habitat just wasn't suitable for them and you have so much stuff that's overgrown and and um, non-native species of just you know, plant life just growing, which isn't isn't helping, and it's something that we talked to um michael chamberlain about last year and he goes a big part is just, you know, the the things that that we do just are not good enough for the habitat and it is having a huge effect on the turkey pump, not only just in New Jersey, but just all over, all over the country.
Speaker 4:Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. I'm just really, I really have my fingers crossed that we have a good, dryer spring again, like we've had the past two years, because it really, really, really helps with that pulp production when we have those. You know, like I guess in 2021, 2022, we had those real cold, long cold spells in the spring. You know what I mean and it just it just hammers those hens when they're on their nest.
Speaker 4:You know they just lose all the broods and you can definitely tell, you know. You can tell when you have, you know, two good hatches and you have all those crazy two-year-olds gobbling everywhere and you know what I mean.
Speaker 3:They're fun yeah, definitely, and it's just like. It's just so crazy how, like you know how everything works, because, like I can, like when I used to hunt the refuge, I can go and sit literally you know all deer season and see only maybe like a handful of turkeys if I'm lucky, and then it's. You know, here we are, you know come, you know springtime you're, you're all amped up, you're waiting to hear that gobble and just nothing. It's just the woods are quiet, just dead.
Speaker 4:It's just like yeah, it's crazy and it's funny because, uh, I vividly remember my first sighting of wild turkeys in New Jersey and it was in 1990 and it was on a wildlife management area in Sussex County okay and you know, from like 1990 to like 0102 I mean up there, man, it just blew up. The population was amazing. You know what I mean.
Speaker 4:Um, yeah and those numbers have. You know, those numbers lasted a long time and obviously, like I was saying before, you're gonna have bad hatches, you're gonna have good hatches. They're gonna fluctuate. You know what I mean. But, like you said, you can. You can really see on that landscape when there aren't birds there. You know what I mean. It's not like they're just not gobbling that morning. You know, if you're running trail cameras, if you're on there bow hunting in the fall, um, you're just not seeing those winter flocks. You know when they're flocking up in the winter. You're going to know. You're going to see the sign. You're going to see all the scratching everywhere. You know there's, you know, 12 to 25 birds walking through. You know I mean they. They leave a mark whether you're hearing them or not. You know and if you're not seeing them.
Speaker 3:They're not there, you know yep, no, couldn't say better myself. But do you have something, mike, you look like you want to say something no, no, I will. Okay, I thought I was going to interrupt you no, not this time all right, perfect. So I was gonna ask so um, have you ever killed a turkey with a bow before, or no? Yeah, or do you prefer just shotgun?
Speaker 4:yeah, shotgun, yeah, yeah, yeah, 20 gauge, that's what I, that's what I hunt with. Yes, yep, yep. And you know I started hunting with a hand-me-down 870, remington 870, you know just like just what I had. You know I don't come from a hunting family. I started bow. I actually started bow hunting first in 1990. I just got an old Hoyt youth model from Sportsman Center in Bordentown.
Speaker 4:You know where so many of us got. You know that first, uh, first hunting weapon, I had a family friend who saw that I was into, uh, nature and the outdoors and you know, kind of took me under his wing, was like you know, you're, you're in the woods all the time looking for snakes, looking for turtles, all that type of stuff. And he was like you know, he saw that I was interested in what tails. So he took me in, got the bow and everything and I actually just like started hunting with a bow. Like, just sit on the ground, going to public ground hunting with a bow. You know, um, but I never killed a turkey with about no, I have not, I have not.
Speaker 3:It's kind of kind of crazy I'm in the same boat, so um. So, what were you saying? No, nothing. Oh, I had my I was gonna. I told you like I gotta stop looking at you, mike. I'm sorry, but all right. So let's shift a little gears here. So have you been out trout season yet? How's your trout season going?
Speaker 4:Good man, really cool, really good. I went to the Mentored Youth Day. I take my daughter every year to Mentored Youth Day. I think this was year 11 for us. Didn't catch anything, but it's all about traditions. You know we're very I'm really into traditions like that, you know, getting kids involved in the outdoors and stuff. And then I went to the opener in Pennsylvania and did really good, did really good, caught like I caught six and a golden rainbow, which was pretty cool. That's awesome. And you know Pennsylvania stocks a good variety. They still stock brookies, they still stock browns, rainbows and then the golden rainbows, which are really cool too. And then last week I fished a spot near me in Jersey and did pretty good there too also. So it's definitely been a good trout season so far.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, it sounds like a hell of a trout season. I haven't even been out yet. Sounds like a hell of a trout season. I haven't even been out yet.
Speaker 4:I like to uh for these three or four weeks before my turkey season kicks off. I love like I need something to do. You know what I mean. Like yeah, a hundred percent. Like go do something.
Speaker 4:So I'm like I get in the trout, I get the trout bug for, like, you know like four or five weeks, you know what I mean, and then it's just like burns out, then I'm just all turkeys. You know like four or five weeks, you know what I mean, and then it's just like burns out, then I'm just all turkeys all turkeys all the time.
Speaker 3:Yup, listen, a hundred percent. That's why I've been dying to even just just take the wife and kid out, you know cause they've been asking me. I just haven't had the time cause it's always something happening, you know so. But I mean I've been, I've been itching to get out there, but I've never caught a golden trout before. Yeah.
Speaker 4:They are super awesome. That's a bucket list.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's definitely on my bucket list.
Speaker 4:They are cool, man. You guys got to get your Pennsylvania license and head across the river, without a doubt, because they stock very, very, very nice fish too.
Speaker 3:The golden rainbows are usually their breeder stock, so they're like three to four years old old and they're getting them out of the hatchery, you know. So they're a nice fish, yeah, yeah, they're awesome. They're really cool. That's nice. I remember the first time when I caught my first like hooker winter fish. You know, for uh, for jersey, I caught my first trout. He was only like nine inches, but when I saw a tag hanger man I did like a back flip. I was like, finally, I finally did it. And that was it. Only happened to me once, hey but it happened once.
Speaker 4:That's all, that's all that counts. Yeah, that's awesome though. That's cool. That's cool as heck. Without a doubt, I love, um, I also love to fish for, uh, native brook trout in like north central pennsylvania. So we take a couple, we trips a year to Sullivan County, usually near the Loyal Sock Creek. So I love that too. I would love it. I mean, I love it, but I would love it more if it was more accessible. You know what I mean. But it's always, you know, living in southern New Jersey. I don't have access to, you know, native brook trout strange, or anything like that. But I do. I do love catching native brookies and obviously wild Browns too. We get into them up there too, but I just just don't, you know, just not, not, it's not close enough to me to do it all the time, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we, we got them up here, all you know, on a bunch of the streams and everything like that, and a Brown is still still on my, my like that, and a brown is still still on my my list of trout. I've caught almost everything except for the golden and and the brown. I've done native brooks and you know stuff like that and I love trout fishing. I really do. I just off. You know.
Speaker 2:You know frank, and I have been talking. You know a lot of us talk it. We spent so much time getting ready for hunting season and you know things like that and deer hunting and and just hunting during during the year, that fishing really has taken the back seat because then it's family time and you know we got to do other stuff and you're working as much as you can so you can get out in the woods to hunt and everything like that. And it's a definitely a shame and you know I even I was even tell Frank like I here in New Jersey, unfortunately, and you know I even I was even tell frank like I here in new jersey, unfortunately. You know, yes, a big part of is a lot of you know docking and everything like that, but it's like on that opening day in the week, like the rain has just been awful. I feel like the last couple of years where the water levels are just like unbearable and it's just like I feel like like what last year last year frank, and the water was just so high and rough, it's like raging
Speaker 2:and you know this year I mean it's it's rained a lot, of course, the days off that you know, the time that we we do it's nice out, we're all at work and we we can't get out and everything like that. So you know, I I wish the weather would cooperate a little bit better, especially during the early parts of trout season, before turkey, you know, heads up. But the cool thing also about turkey is, you know, I'm gonna make sure I bring the pole and everything like that and try to get out and do some trout fishing right after turkey's done 100 man, that's the 100% man.
Speaker 4:That there's no doubt about that, no doubt about that, and I think it's kind of cool. Like I said, growing up as a kid, I always wanted to identify things and know what things are.
Speaker 4:You know, it's just kind of it's just kind of bled into that. And then you realize like, wait a minute, you know. You start putting a and B together and realizing like okay, these acorns, they like at this time of the year, these red oaks, they like at this time of year, these white oaks, they like at this time of the year. You know what I mean. And it all that whole web kind of opens up, you know, opens your eyes to like what's what's really going on in those natural systems. And and then you realize like okay, well, you know, why am I going to be able to find deer at this time of the year here? Why am I going to be able to, you know, find these shagbark hickories and go try to hunt some twirls in this area? You know what I mean, like, like you said, it all comes together like that 100, 100.
Speaker 3:No doubt about that, which absolutely, and it probably helps you with, uh, with your shed hunting too, I would imagine yes, yep, yep, without a doubt.
Speaker 4:That man, yep, yep, without a doubt, you know? Um, as far as my shed hunting, I'm just always looking for uh bedding. You know what I mean if I'm in the bedding, I know at least I'm in the right area.
Speaker 4:You know, um, yeah, with shed hunting, you got to realize that, like 90 of the woods you want to get through you know what I mean and you just hit those spots where the sheds are.
Speaker 4:You know, I mean, like, and I've been shed hunting for a long time and I didn't know that for a long time I would just, you know, walk in the woods so slow. Now I, now I can see the woods and I know, like, okay, you know I can, I can speed up in these areas that I call dead zones. And then, once you get in those shady areas where you know you can see the bed and you can see the feeding, you see a lot more signs. Um, you know, okay, now I gotta, now I gotta take it easy and slow down and really, you know, start focusing on, depending on if I'm in new jersey, what type of habitat I look for the sheds in new jersey or if I'm in pennsylvania, what type of habitat, um, that I try to key in and focus on in Pennsylvania. But it all comes together with knowing what species you're looking for and what is providing food at different times of the year. You know what I mean, like you said, it all, it all comes together without a doubt, without a doubt.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's something I want to do. To grow as an outdoorsman is, you know, kind of know, just learn everything about the land and you know just when things, you know when certain food is going to be available, you know what's best for. You know from right now, from summer, you know that, early spring to summertime to fall to winter, and you know what. Obviously everyone knows acorns and things like that and you know what. Obviously everyone knows acorns and things like that. But there's just so much more out there that probably there's things that we probably don't even really know.
Speaker 2:You know, I mean, I, animals, just like they're, just, they're so equipped at survival and you know, obviously as humans we've lost a lot of touch with that just because now we get the sleeping homes, ac, heat, you know, and every it is different, you know, now for us, but every day is a survival for them.
Speaker 2:You know, and these creatures, they, they, they just know. You know, and when it's that time of the year, you know we'll keep it simple with acorns. It's like you know where you need to be as a hunter If you, you know acorns are dropping. You know you got to find that hot sign and everything like that, and it's like something I want to know is be able to be out in the woods and spot something like okay, this is what I'm looking at, this is going to help me, you know, come, you know, you know, maybe later in the year, maybe, you know, whatever the case is, when the food dwindles, you know, maybe this is something that they're going to come back to, you know, in winter and something like that. And that's something I really want to get get better at as a as outdoorsman.
Speaker 4:Absolutely man, absolutely Like. I like I always tell you know, I work with a couple of young guys who are just kind of getting into hunting and stuff like that and uh, I kind of feel like, with um, social media now there's like so much pressure on a lot of people to like kill a giant buck right away or kill a turkey right away, or numbers of turkeys.
Speaker 4:You know, and I try to tell them. You know like it could be years before you shoot your first buck, it could be years before you take your first turkey. And don't let any of that. You know, get in the woods and learn all the stuff that we're talking about right now first, because all those things will then happen and it'll all click and it'll all open up in front of your eyes. You'll you'll start putting those pieces together. You know what I mean, but you know it's not about. You know going out there for three sits and you know shooting a 138 buck in new jersey. You know what I mean, like, but I think a lot of people's mind that's like what you're supposed to do, that's, it's just supposed to click and it's supposed to happen. You know what I mean because they're scrolling all day looking at big bucks from iowa. You know what I mean and it's like it's just. You know, it's just not. You know that's not not what you're working with.
Speaker 3:Yep, yep no, I mean especially with jersey being like such a big baiting state. Yes, itself it's, you know everybody. Just, I think a lot of people rely on that too, you know so 100 it's like they're like why am I going to go do all that or put in that all that effort? I could just throw a ladder stand, throw some corn or whatever I have apples and let them come to me that a lot of people look at it that way absolutely man 100, and you know, to each their own.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean, like yeah I'm one of those guys that's like if, if, it's legal in that state and that's what you want to do. God bless you. You know what I mean. I might not be into it, but who am I, you know what I mean. Like yeah you can.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean. I might not be into it, but who am I, you know what I mean. Like, yeah, you can you know, do, do whatever you're going to do, and I'm going to do whatever I'm going to do, you know. But, but, as we were saying once, you know, for myself, at least it's, it's more fulfilling to it's grouse, whatever that is. It's kind of like, you know, when you put that together, you really can you know you could be dropped off anywhere in the woods and put that together in like four or five days and and be in the game. At least you know what I mean. Yeah, which which, like I said, from, just for me, just personally, that's a lot more fulfilling than, you know, just sitting over a pile of corn. But, like, like I said, if it's legal, it's awesome. You know, if it's legal and the person's happy, that's really all that it's about, you know.
Speaker 2:Facts Yep, definitely facts.
Speaker 3:No, I agree, Definitely Go ahead, mike. What?
Speaker 2:were you going to say you know I want to. Let's get to like maybe one or two more turkey Questions. We never know how much time we have Before it's going to cut out on us. Frankie, you Got one more for the turkey talk uh, let me think you you start.
Speaker 2:First let me think I'll go um, you know for you, you know you, you've been hunting, now, birds for for a while. Now you know what is the one key advice you would give to you know, maybe a a new turkey hunter that, uh, you wish you had, uh the knowledge when you, when you first got into it oh, that's an easy one.
Speaker 4:That's the patience. Like I was talking about man, because I literally, you know, can't, can't tell you how many birds I messed up through the years. You know what I mean. So it would literally just be just patience and and kind of let the bird tell you what it's kind of doing first and then make your move on that bird. You know what I mean. Just just give them a chance to do what they're going to do for a second before you. You know, before you over call, before you move too close to the roost, before you, you know, if you're going in the dark, like I said, I've done it a million times, getting too close to that bird and bumping it, or you know thinking, okay, this is the only thing it's going to do, it's's going to land. You know, I set myself up to where there's an opening and it's going to. You know, pitch off that roost and come and drop 40, you know 40, 45 yards in front of me and it's going to be over. You know, just have patience. That's really, that's really the main, the main thing. You know. Yeah, I agree. Oh, I'm sorry. No, no, go ahead.
Speaker 4:I would also say spend time in the woods. That's, that's. That's also really, really the number one thing. You know, make you know, know where birds are, get yourself situated where you you know to, to put yourself in the best situation. You know what I mean. That's it. Just put, put your time and be in the woods.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, like I. I couldn't have said it better myself, because I think one of the things I'm guilty of is I love hearing the birds gobble. So I'll you know, it's like one of those things where, like you know, you hear them. You hear them gobbling you right away. Like you know, my first instinct is to want to call back to them. Right, and I mean it sounds and it'll look good for the camera, it'll sound good for the camera, it'll sound good for the camera. But I think a lot of people get caught up and just hearing him gobble myself included, and I mean I've, I've blew it a couple times doing that and then I'm like shit, like I should have been more quiet, I should have waited. You think about it after the fact, you know, but your heart's going, you're all pumped. You know you hear them, and it's just. You know that that's turkey hunting, though you know.
Speaker 4:That's a hundred percent, man. Like I said, I start listening for birds in February and that first bird, I hear in the morning man, like the first bird I'll hear. It might be like February 28th and I hear one on the limb and I literally start shaking and I'm like, oh my God, you got to calm down, so I 100% understand what you're saying and, like I said, I've done it a thousand times exactly what you're talking about.
Speaker 4:Just trying to sneak, you know, trying to be too aggressive, push in too close, call too much. I've done it, definitely 100%, but that you know. Just just, I guess, messing up enough, I learned to be like, okay, don't, don't, don't do that. You know what I mean? That's it. That's it. That's the name of the game. But yeah, no you gotta mess up to get it right. You know what I mean. That that's pretty much what it is, you know oh, 100.
Speaker 3:Now. Do you prefer hunting by yourself or with somebody else, so like I primarily hunt by myself.
Speaker 4:Yes, yep, if I do. Like I said, when I go to pennsylvania, we kind of have a little camp, we have a little, uh, a crew that goes there, but I I primarily hunt by myself. Um, for, honestly, for everything, I have um a good friend that I that that I bow hunt white tails with, but we we hunt like in the same general area, but you know we might drive in and and he drops me off and he goes a mile away. You know what I mean. Like, like something like that.
Speaker 2:You know we might drive in and and he drops me off and he goes a mile away, you know what I mean like, like, something like that.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean, but primarily I do hunt by myself.
Speaker 3:Yes, yep yeah, I think I I'm in the same boat there, but you know, I mean it is fun, you know, because I'll go with one of our guys uh, you know, outdoors and more squats me, me and him will go and I'll usually have him do all the calling. So all I gotta do is worry about shooting, you know. So it, you know it's each zone it could benefit you, but you know, it's one of those things where you're like, you know, you know turkeys are smart, they got that eyesight. And you know it's one of those where you're like oh, you know well, cause, like I can't wait to take my son out, but I'm so scared of like him moving or something you know, and because I want him to get the full experience.
Speaker 4:So absolutely, man, absolutely. I uh. A good friend of mine, his uh brother-in-law, just got into hunting and uh took his test and he pulled his first turkey tag for new jersey, uh, this year. So I'm super excited I am going to hunt with people this year for the first time. He got one of the Y tags. So we're going two Saturdays from now and I'm just going to be calling no gun, no nothing, and I'm actually so excited about that. You know, just to almost relive some of those first memories. You know what I mean. Like I'm really excited about that, to just be sitting back there calling helping of those first memories. You know what I mean. Like I'm really excited about that, to just be sitting back there calling helping out, doing anything that I can to try to. You know you. You know I say try to get, try to get him his first bird, but it's so much more than that. You know what I mean.
Speaker 4:Just he's literally like like a baby in the woods. He is right now. You know what I mean. So he's gonna hear his first call, you know, first morning when you're waking up, when when the woods are coming alive and whippoorwills are calling and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3:You know he's gonna, he's gonna experience all that and I'm super excited, super excited for that yeah, it also puts a lot of pressure on you too, though a lot of people don't realize, because you know, you want to get them their first bird or whatever you know, and it just you put that extra stress on yourself and you know Turkey hunt at all.
Speaker 4:So he's texting me where are the birds at? You got them all shut up and I'm like dude, I'm trying, I'm trying.
Speaker 3:Cause you almost don't want to let them down, and it's like yeah, 100%, man.
Speaker 4:I'm more nervous about those hunts than you know than my own, than my own spots or anything like that you know, Yep, because at least if you blow it, nobody's there watching too. Oh, and I've blown it a million times, so it's just like yeah, just another one. That's exactly right, man.
Speaker 3:That's a hundred times. Yeah, I've done that before too many times. Haven't we all yeah, you got another question.
Speaker 2:Mike, or you want to end it there, you want to keep going. It's up to you. Um, you know what? Okay, listen, if we, if we got the opportunity, we'll, we'll go one more um you know when you're, you know when you're, you're after when you.
Speaker 2:When does your prep really start for turkey season? So I like, obviously you know a lot of people do multi like, hey, during deer season I'm still looking at at turkey time, but do you the minute deer season's over, or is that what you think about is birds, birds, birds. Um, you know, are you going right or are you waiting a little bit, maybe waiting for for winter to die down? The snow? Well, at least you know the snow's up here for the most part. But, like, when is your your focus to turkeys kind of shifting, you know? And when are you going to start? You know, going to watch the birds in the morning and maybe in the evening and things like that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I'm bad I am. I got birds, Literally. You can you know my wife, my, daughter.
Speaker 2:They're like okay, we know there's turkeys there.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean. It's all the time I'm one of those guys that's like you know, in September earn a buck. You know what I mean. Like I'm literally looking for flocks and looking for sign and all that kind of stuff. It's kind of a year-round deal, but definitely, like, mid-february is when the switch is flipped. You know, I do hunt fall. I hunt fall birds in New Jersey and I do hunt fall birds in Pennsylvania too. Obviously, our season in New Jersey was the, you know, was whittled down to the four days. So you know, I would just try to get out on that Saturday of the season and, you know, chase birds in the fall. That time too, I really enjoy. I really enjoy fall hunting also.
Speaker 4:Uh, fall hunting, turkeys. Only because it's so different than the spring. You know you're, you're you're dealing with larger flocks of birds. You're trying to break that flock up, scatter them and call them back to you, um, so it's just kind of like a different, you know different strategy. You don't to, you don't have to roost them, you don't have to. It's a lot more low pressure. You know turkey hunting and I really enjoy that. So that's why it's not really a time when I when I'm not thinking about turkeys, you know.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Do you find a?
Speaker 3:lot of success in the fall.
Speaker 4:What's that?
Speaker 3:So do you find a lot of success?
Speaker 4:in the fall compared to in the springtime when you can call them in. I do yes, yeah, yeah, they're, they're um. You know when they're in that flock and you break the flock up, they are. You know they're programmed to get back together to find um, to find food together, to roost together, to uh watch out for predators together. You know there are any um feelings at that time is we have to be together. We got to predators together. You know that there are any feelings at that time is we have to be together. We got to be together. You know what I mean. So you can really. They're really receptive to calling and they're very, very, very.
Speaker 4:A lot of people don't realize it, but they're communicating constantly in the fall. Sometimes they're gobbling more in the fall. On a fall morning sometimes I'll hear more gobbling than on like a really low May. You know we just don't have a lot of gobbling in New Jersey. You'll hear them communicating on the roost and talking to each other and making all kinds of noise, which for me that's almost at the stage of the game right now. I love just hearing the birds communicate and seeing their habitat, seeing how they come off the roost, then killing a bird, you know what I mean. That's just. That's just where I am like. You know what I mean. So in the fall, you really can see that a lot. You know what I mean yeah.
Speaker 2:Now, if you could pick one deer hunting or turkey hunting, what would it be? Uh, turkeys all the time.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I kind of yeah I got it for after I figured you were a big turkey on it.
Speaker 4:But it is weird, like you know, that first cold front in september. Like you know, like mid-september, that first cold front, it does like it does something. You know what I mean. Like I'm like all right, I gotta, I gotta get up in a climber, and you know what I mean with the bow in my hand but it doesn't last, that's's a thing. It'll be like October after Halloween. It's like all right, when are we getting to the turkey issue? We're so close.
Speaker 2:We pushed the envelope as far as we can go. So what we'll do? We'll have Frank wrap it up and we'll schedule for you know, frank can schedule for another time.
Speaker 2:I think we've got enough. Not quite in our usual hour hour 15, um, but I think we we've got enough. What that I can work with, uh, and then what we'll do is, when deer season comes around, we'll schedule a day. Maybe, if it's a day that we're all off, maybe we do it early, earlier in the day, or something like that. Um, yeah, I mean, hopefully this should never happen again. You know what I mean. Um, so, but listen, it was a great conversation. So I mean I, I had fun, even with the stops and starts, like I yep, oh, absolutely, man.
Speaker 4:I appreciate you guys asking me and having me.
Speaker 2:Man, I really do yeah, I appreciate you coming on the show man why don't you give a official wrap up? And then yeah all right.
Speaker 3:Hey, mike, we appreciate you coming on the show. Everybody go check out bike. He's a new jersey wood lender. We appreciate the turkey and the the trout talk. Unfortunately we're having some technical difficulties. It's not our fault, but uh, we hope everybody enjoyed it. Hope everybody enjoyed this episode and we'll see you guys next time.
