SPEAKER_01 0:29

But in 2019, something changed for the first time. Brian uh stepped up and started using trail cams. What he captured would it actually just spark something new to him? It actually sparked a bit of a fire and ultimately a moment that would change everything that people even does shooting and hunting. So without further ado, I want to talk about the upcoming story with Brian. This is the legend of Kix. So Brian, first off, I want to say welcome to the show, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:00

Hey, thank you, Zach. Very uh excited to be here. This is awesome.

Learning Woodsmanship Before Apps

SPEAKER_01 1:04

Yeah, same here, man. So with Kix, um, let's talk about the story a little bit. So in this was in fall of 2019, and you decided to place a trail cam up.

Trail Cam Photos Create An Obsession

Seasons Pressure And A Ghost Buck

You Cannot Kill Them On The Couch

Kix Shows Up In Daylight

Full Draw Under Maximum Pressure

Recovery Under Moonlight And Tears

SPEAKER_02 1:16

Yeah, so my whole life, you know, like like you said in the intro, I actually um was raised by my grandfather and uncle and um pretty much learned woodsmanship at an early age. And um back in those days there wasn't inches, there was just getting a nice buck. My granddad would call it a dandy, and I was always um wanting to make them proud by being able to hang a deer on our family oak tree. And um, that's what I I strive for. So as time went on, the technology over the years, and this is back in the 80s. Um, technology, we just had Polaroid pictures back then, and our technology was going to a country store bragging on the uh bragging board with a Polaroid, but as time got on, as it goes on, um you know, social media has hit the game, hit, hit, hit, you know, the hunting industry. And um, I was really reluctant to ever use a cell camera. And a lot of my friends were like, hey man, you gotta, you know, go out there and put some out. And I was like, well, so I bought an SD card um trail camera on that. I think it was like in May uh May, May of 29, uh 2019. I'm sorry. And I uh didn't know what I was doing. I just went out to an area that I knew was a good area and I hung it. Um and I was like, man, let me, you know, I let it sit for a couple weeks. I came back, got the SD card, and I put it in my computer and saw a couple does, a couple pictures, and all of a sudden there was this big mainframe 10 pointer, and I just stopped. And I it's the first, you know, anybody's first time they ever get a really nice buck on their camera or an area that's heavily pressured, um, just blew me away. And I just stared at it. My wife's looking at me like, what I said, look at this. She's like, Good grief. And this is in July, so this is July, and he's already framed up, you know, really nice, and I could tell he was gonna be a beautiful deer. So I had a few pictures of him, but they are all all you know, nighttime. And right, August um went through and he started developing, he developed a little kicker off of his back G2. So after getting many pictures of him, um, I just said, you know, I'm gonna the kicks just came out, you know, of I'm gonna name him that, and it just stuck, it just was fitting for him, and you know, felt it like the rock band, which share it with some of my buddies, and um I got uh I got really like having dreams about this deer, it just kept going on, and you know, I had other properties, but nothing was really this big of a deer as far as maturity and in the rack, and I was um really just blown away. So in Virginia, there's a couple uh there's an early season they have, and then they have uh for dough only, and then they have uh youth season, which is the week before bow season, which uh young uh kids can go out with their parents and use a rifle. And that one bothered me a lot because in knowing that area, I know that you know there was probably the opportunity for him to be taken that way or in this area because it's only 10 acres and it bordered up some other properties. And um I you know heard shots, you always think of the worst, and so that uh Friday night before the season opener, um, I got invited to go to uh a concert with one of my buddies down in Richmond, and we were driving down there. And I mean, I got I said, Hey man, you don't mind if I pull out my SD card? I pull the cameras. I you know, I want to see, I haven't seen kicks in you know, a couple weeks. He hadn't shown, you know, it's like he hadn't shown he's been ghost, and I put the SD card in and there was nothing, man. So I was like, gone it, you know, this is this is gonna be um this is, you know, I guess you know it's not meant to be, I'm not sure. So he kind of has been ghost, you know, and I figured he got taken, but I kept up the hope, and I really, really did not haunt the area at all um until the wind was right. And I needed to have like a northwest wind from the way I was figuring of how he um actually was approaching the way I always saw him on the camera, is what I thought. So um I I just kind of hunted other areas, hunted in there a couple times when the wind was right, never saw him. And I have limited time. I worked, you know, I worked um pretty much try to save like most hunters, you know, your vacation time during the rut or somewhere in between those, and still a little early in the bow season. So um that October 19th day after I got back from you know the concert, I was gonna go that Saturday morning, and I got up and um I walked outside and the wind was hitting me in the wrong way. And I was like, man, let me pull out my app real quick. And I got and you know, I got all I thought I was getting all tech savvy with the app and the app what it would say, and the app was saying, you know, southwest wind, and you know, I was like, Oh man, so I just came back in the house, man, took my shoes off, sat on the couch, and I'm sitting there like man, I guess you know, I'm trying to figure out where I was gonna do that evening, maybe. And about that time my wife gets up and she turns the corner and sees me sitting there, and she goes, What are you doing here? And I said, I said, uh, well, honey, I said, This um my app says the wind's wrong, and she she stopped, she went over to make some coffee. She said, You what? I said, My app. I said, It's the latest, greatest thing we have. You know, it tells you which way is the wind blowing, and um it gives you really good. And I I need a a north wind, and I and I got a south wind right now. And she goes, What are you talking about? And I was like, I was like, you know, I'm having this conversation with my wife, and I'm sitting on the couch and she's over there making her coffee, and she goes, I've known you, we're high school sweethearts since you were 15 years old, and all the gear you have taken through these years, you have never talked such, you know, like hat, wind, stuff like that. And you know, she's right, you know, looking back at it, she's right. I was, and you know, we'll get to this later, but I said, Listen, you know, I got a cell camera out here, I got this wind app, I know technology, you know. I'm not I'm not gonna mess this up. She goes, Oh, I got you. She goes, Okay. She goes, Well, honey, I don't know a whole lot about deer, honey, but I know one thing. I said, What's that? She goes, You can't kill them sitting there on the couch. And I mean, that I tell you what, that that lit a fire in me, man. Like, when your wife says that to you. So I was like, you know what? I'm just gonna freaking go. And she's like, Oh, no, no, no, honey. I don't want to mess up you and your app and all. And uh, I said, you know what? I'm going. She goes, No, seriously, if it's gonna mess, I said no. So I had an attitude, I will have to admit, and I went, and I went, I got out in the tree stand about close to three o'clock, 2:30, and got up in the tree, and the wind was wrong, it was back of my back of my neck, like I thought. So I sat there pouting as four o'clock came, five o'clock came. About six o'clock was coming, and I just started just my face was red. I was like, I should have never listened to her. I probably boogered this whole thing up, man. And I kind of looked, I looked over to my left and I saw some movement, and I thought I caught a horn. I'm like, was that a buck? And I I saw these does started to kind of fiddle out, and I heard this that faint grunt sound, right? So I just heard and this is October 19th, right? So I just grabbed my bow and just stood there, and then these does started kind of feeding their way to me, and I heard it again, and then I saw some horns coming, and still didn't think it was him for a second. And then next thing I know, these does are like 10 yards from me, and one's bouncing around. It was eight does, and the like the seventh of the eighth dough was just bouncing around, and that was the one that I guess was coming in the heat pretty much, and he showed himself. And when he did, I saw that kicker off the side, and I said, Oh my god, it's kicks, and I just was just blown away. So he's actually to the left of where I thought he was coming instead of straight ahead of me. So the wind, he's barely on the outside of the wind coming. He's coming just on the other side of it, and the way they're coming, and I didn't expect them to be that way, and then now the deer underneath of me feeding on acorns, right? And that one deer, and he's coming just like on a string, and he stops, and it's like 26 yards. And I I wish to this day I had a GoPro or I had some kind of camera because he he actually put his head down, lifted his rack up and lip curled, and just went. And I'm just staying, I can't do nothing. I got my bow in my hand, and I'm like trying not to shake. And I'm just like, then he just shook his rack like this, back and forth like a dog. You know how dog shakes his head? Oh, yeah, yeah. I'm like, you have got to be kidding me. And he did that. The one does started bouncing around, and then she went over to the right, and I'm like, How am I gonna get a shot on him? And they slowly just started turning, and when he turned, he was almost fully broadside, he was following that other deer, and I was like, Man, it's now or never. And that's that's the thing about bow hunting. I try to tell a lot of people the when you get to full draw, and I had does around me, so I had to do it as quiet as I could, right? And I'm like almost closing my eyes, you know, because I'm so nervous and I'm drawing back, I'm drawing back, I'm drawing back, and it finally breaks, and nothing happened, and you're like, Oh my god, it's gonna happen, you know, and you just got to compose yourself, and you have that short five-second window of a million things that you train yourself in the offseason of don't twerk your bow, follow through, anchor point, you know, just trust, trust it behind the shoulder. And man, when I really I just squeezed it off, and it was at 26 yards, and I I didn't have a lighted knock at the time, right? And I just heard I just heard a big crack, like and he went up in the air like the Denver Bronco. I'll just never forget this. He was in the air like the Denver Bronco logo, just doing this for a second. That's great, and then hit the ground and just bounced off, and he stopped down in the bottom about 60-70 yards, and as he stood there, it was starting to get dark, and it was a full moon coming up at the same time. So there's a full moon, it's getting dark, so it's really kind of staying light. And I didn't have my by nose either, but I could see the right the left side of his rack standing there, and then I could catch like his hind quarter on the right side, right? Looking, and the does were kind of just they they just kind of were all over the place, right? Looking around, and he's just stayed there, and I'm like, I know I hit him, and I just kept looking and I I peeked around at the right side for a little bit, and then it was then your eyes are playing tricks on you because it's getting dark, and then I looked back and I couldn't see the rack anymore. So I'm like, Oh man, god. Now they just man, all the motions hit me, put the bow up. First thing I did was text my wife. Oh my god, honey, I shot kicks. Then I text my best friend, and she's she replied back, Oh, I'm so happy for you. And I'm like, she goes, you know, can't wait to see him. And I'm like, Well, you don't know yet. I'm just you know, I'm still in the tree. I think I'm in a good shot. We all been there, yeah. So um I uh I just you know um stood there as long in the tree as long as I could, about another half hour, it's dark, and then I finally said, Look, I'm just gonna walk down to where I last seen him. And I got down out of the tree. I didn't walk to where I shot, I walked in the angle to where I last seen him, and under the moonlight, I saw something kind of white down that way. So I man, should I took my flashlight or let me just see? And I clicked my flashlight on real quick, and there was nothing. I clicked my flashlight off, and it was like something white. And I was like, That is this is crazy. Why didn't any you know? So I got a little closer and I could still see something white, you know, kind of, and I'm like, and I clicked my flashlight, and it those eyes just I saw some eyes come back at me. Yeah, and I went, Oh my god, is that is he, you know, and I just eased a little bit more, and I could tell you, I could tell he was down, and then when I got closer to him, and I've never and I've killed hundreds hundreds of deer over the years. I have never, never, ever had this feeling with an animal, but I I I I knelt down with him, and when I put my hand on him, I started crying.

SPEAKER_01 14:55

I believe it.

Scoring The Buck And Meaning

SPEAKER_02 14:56

Yep, tears came down the side of my face, and I looked, I looked at him, and the emotion was so tremendous, it was like such a relief, but such a heartbreak at the same time, because it's over, you know. That we met, and and this is where we were. So that whole thing is just undescribable. That you know, and I think as much as you know, the questions asked a lot of times about cell cameras and this and that, there, and and that's the good part of if you can get you almost have a real you have a relationship, you feel like with this animal, right? That when it all comes to fruition, and it can be the other way where you have a relation and it never happens, you know. And um that it was just so emotional, and you know that that deer was um very special to me, and it's actually I think it's uh there it is, it's that deer right there. Yeah, so that's kicks right there, and he's very special to me. And um actually just had him taken to the PA show where he was scored and um Virginia Pope and Young, he made the books. Um, he was a 150 gross. Wow, and then he wound up. Pope and young will beat him to death, so he's just at 139 and like three-fourths, three-quarters. I mean, uh, Pope and Young, but it doesn't matter to me, you know, really. I mean, if if he makes the books, that's that's you know, everything, you know, to me. I'm not, but it was um very, very, very uh, you know, I've I've every every deer on my wall has a has that has a story, um right. But he's a special one, man. That's uh just the way all that worked out because I I don't I really don't think if I didn't go because he I never had a daylight picture of him, and I really Yeah, which is crazy. I know, and I really don't think Zach, if I didn't go that evening, the way he throwing that dough around intending her really hard, that I would have ever gotten it. I really don't, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

I think it's uh absolutely incredible when you are able to actually have this animal in front of you for the first time and you haven't seen him at all with your own eyes yet at this point, have you?

SPEAKER_02 17:26

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

Yeah, so like I can only imagine like that thought process that like hits you, and you're just like wow, this is it, this is like the moment. I can't mess this up. And the the pressure that you have on you is just so incredible. And it just literally radiates throughout your entire body. Like you're headaching, you're just trying to stay calm, and like you said, you took a breath and that adrenaline hopefully calmed down just a little bit. I mean, it worked. I mean, whatever it was you did, it it helped you calm your nerves, and you're able to to put that arrow through him. And just the the picture of him alone, just seeing him in the background is just absolutely jaw-dropping. He is just a beautiful deer.

SPEAKER_02 18:10

No, thank you so much, man. And when I when I actually saw him for the first time in um I, you know, got to see him first time in the you know, daylight in the live, um, he was every bit of what my trail cameras, if not more, man. Just you know, right, you know, like a 22-inch inside spread, just over up top, just big, big tall tines, just a you know, just a beautiful Virginia deer, man. Very beautiful deer. And then uh the show he put on, and the only you know, I look back and I think what kept me calm is I I get my I get I actually coach myself and I get kind of mad that I don't go into awe on a deer when I see one. I get mad that you're not, you know, I'm looking at I see him, and I'm not I do not look at its rack. I try not to look at it, but the perennial of the thing was just like you couldn't miss it, but I wouldn't look at it. But I said, You're not gonna break me, you're not gonna break me. I've trained too hard. I've this is not gonna, you're not gonna do it. And I just kept coaching myself through that moment. And right that's the thing with um with bow hunting, man, because even doing this for so long, you still you can slip up so many times, and so many things can happen. Um, and it's just so rewarding when it all goes into your favor.

SPEAKER_01 19:41

Yeah, I that feeling is absolutely incredible. Um now, the real question is though, when you're when you texted your wife and you said that you got them, did she say, uh-huh, I told you so, or is it one of those like, oh she let it be and to this day she doesn't say anything about it?

SPEAKER_02 20:02

You know, she's she's awesome, man. She she never um said that at first. Um she never said that at first. She um actually um did after the fact. Um I think she let about a week ago, and when I was telling the stories with my friends and stuff when they were over, she's like, you know, you wouldn't have got that dear.

When Tech Starts Dictating Hunts

SPEAKER_00 20:28

And I said, absolutely, you know, I wanted to let her know that she she's fully correct on that because that that um her her kick in my butt got me off the couch, and uh real quick, what what what I want to add to add to that whole thing and something of of the basis of you know, I I love and I'm a huge cell cam guy, don't get me wrong, a huge cell cam guy. And it every year I always look at myself like sometimes I let the cell cams dictate kind of how I'm going to hunt and what I'm going to do. And this is kind of like a perfect example for the you know, the the generation coming up, you know, I'm I'm in my 30s now, but there's kids now who they grew up on cell cameras now, they didn't have the SDs and and and all these things, but they are completely just thrown into all this technology, and yes, it's great in some instances, but on some others, it's very misleading. And if you sometimes I think as bow hunters, especially we dive too much and we overthink constantly, like, oh, the wind's not right, the thermos aren't working. Um, you know, it's it's too hot, like you know, one for one example, you know, Halloween last year. I I'm like, oh, I'm not gonna hunt this one spot. It's too damn hot. It was like 90 degrees. I'm gonna go sit at a you know water source. Happens later, my number one hit list buff came cruising right through, you know, where I was going to hunt if it wasn't for it being too hot. And a big part was I looked out on my apps and showed I was like, ah, the movement is not gonna be there. And that's this is like that prime example of that.

Fitness And Mobile Hunting Effort

SPEAKER_02 22:22

No, no, you you nailed it, man. So after that, I got happy and bought like four or five cameras, right? Because now I think I've figured it out, the puzzle. And it the following year, I got one and it was SD cards too. I never had a I didn't have a till the following year, I finally got a cell camera, but I I found another deer that daylighted early. This is 2020, 2020, and he daylighted early, and I immediately went into the woods, and I wound up getting that deer too. And I was another pop and young buck. So now I think after that, I had it all, man. I'm gonna just use self-camera, I got it figured out. Then I started hunting cameras, and I'm doing exactly what you said. I did not even shoot a deer, right? Because it's just so wife said to me, She's like, Well, this is the first time I ever know you not to shoot a deer. There was two things twofold for that. One, I was worried kind of subconsciously, what society would think. Um, hey, if you don't shoot a deer this size, maybe they'll look at you and say, Man, you should let it go. Or, you know, maybe I I'm feel embarrassed if I just shoot a basket rack buck or whatever. And that I had to really, it took that took for me to go through that to realize that's not why I hunt. I don't hunt for that. I hunt to provide a hunt for the chase, every deer, and I went back to looking at when did I when did I ever when was I the most successful? And I was the most successful is when I was a savage and I hunted. And I think the bottom line for all of us to learn is you have to be there. You have to be there. It doesn't matter now. If you do have a the wind does play a big factor, sure, 100%. I agree, but it's not that you know how many times it swirls, how many times it changes, and you're like, oh shit, or there's so many variables. The neighbor might have just kicked a deer out because he's walking and he comes under your stand, but you weren't there because you thought, or just so the bottom line, I've I've found and it and it helped me like last year. Um, a couple things is fitness. Um, you know, I'm on the Lone Wolf custom gear team and we mobile haunt a lot. And you know, I'm approaching 60 years old. I'm 50, I'll be 57 this year. And getting into fitness, being able to be able to still mobile haunt, not only helps you be out there more with deer, or be it increases your odds of luck, but it also helps you in life to be better and everything you do because now you're more in shape, you're active. Um, I think it's twofold, you know, to to stay in shape and then have that drive. If it's misty rain, the deer don't the deer don't mind. They they live there, right? You we're the ones that are, you know, and our technology has kept us, you know. We we live in a world of technology, and everything's so fast-paced that it's Friday before we know it all the time. We go, shit, I can't believe it's Friday. I've never used to say that when I was younger, and then we hurry, so then you hurry and you go out into somewhere where an animal lives their little life that's never changed all the years. The white-tailed deer has never changed. What's changed is us by putting stuff in the woods or us being rushing, and their instincts are still the same. And this is where we get sloppy as hunters. We'll cut a corner because we think we know, we'll bang a car door, we'll do all the things just to hurry. And um, I've I've toned it down on my cameras. Man, I I like a camera for inventory, um, because that deer kicks. I would have never bet you I hunted that spot for 10 years, and I never I didn't hunt it a lot because it was so pressured, but I would have never known a deer like that was in there if I didn't have a camera. Um, I think that's good. But then on the flip side, like you're saying, it almost cost me because I thought it was the wrong time to hunt it.

SPEAKER_01 26:36

Yeah, that's that's the one thing that I've always figured out was I try to look into areas where I can't really see what's going on. And then when I get in those areas, I usually see a lot of sign of deer and whatnot. And which that's what blows my mind. Like they're usually in the thicket, and it's like, man, how can I hunt in there? Sometimes you just have to go clear it out. But having the ability to get in areas where others can't, being a mobile hunter, is tenfold so much better. Instead of just going straight into a stand that you just keep throwing over a fluke plot, you just never know what you're gonna see out there. And it's amazing that all the types of deer that you just come across. It doesn't matter how big they are, how small they are, it's just it's just so cool to see like the battle wounds and just from their daily life, and it's just absolutely incredible.

SPEAKER_02 27:32

No, man, it it is so for go ahead. No, no, no, I was just saying it is, and the the thing that got me, you know, as I got older before I joined the lone wolf team, and I have to admit that year I didn't kill a deer, and then I started getting um I want to say complacent of 40 years of hunting, and some of my friends, you know, had the means to make these redneck lines and hunt comfortably, and they got heaters in there and they got windows in there, and shit, one of them's got a TV in there, and I'm like, man, that's nice, isn't it? And then next thing you know, I'm sitting in this stand that's got windows all around it, and I'm like, Man, who what am I doing, man? And it it it's it it almost I was getting I was getting like uh just someone I wasn't, and then when I got back into having the effort to because it's an effort, you know, break your stuff down, put it up a tree, do things and go, it's an effort, man. It's just not like you got to stand out there that's all cushy with carpet in it, and you got a couch in there, and you sit down, and some guys are doing work and they look out and they shoot a deer. But at the end of the day, and again, and that's good for them. But I promise you this much at the end of the day, if you shoot a deer in that kind of comfort, and you shoot a deer in the snow where you hike the mountain two miles and you go back, that story for your grandchildren, that story for your friend when you come over, there's two different stories there. You might not even talk about the one in the blind, but you're gonna talk about that other one, and that's what hunting's about.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 29:17

You know, the effort.

Maps Oaks Sign And Bottlenecks

SPEAKER_01 29:20

Yeah, so do you so do you think you still use your traditions from what your uncle and grandfather have taught you, or have you kind of like modified now utilizing the technology that's out there?

SPEAKER_02 29:33

Yeah, a hundred percent. I actually back my I do um I will check, I'll check a camera, I have a cell camera, I I look at it, but no, I still I still look in, you know, in Virginia, it's predominantly the the if you're not hunting ag, you have to look at I like I really like like on X. I like the uh the hunt the hunt apps you have where you can see properties and boundaries, and then you can yeah, then you can actually, I think that technology is fantastic, and then hit where the ag is, um, and then understand where the deer are living because deer are just like we are. I mean, they have to eat, sleep, right? And they in the and that and eat and but they do it opposite, you know, while we're going to bed, they're getting up, and it's kind of an opposite, it's uh it's kind of opposite, but they're doing the same thing. But once you learn where they live, where is that where are they staying? And I have properties that I've learned by looking at maps and understanding where they're in the cornfields, they're in the ag the soybeans until the farmers cut them, and then when they cut them, then they're coming my way. And those are the areas where some you might keep the does happy until you know the Halloween magic Halloween time comes. Um, so I actually look for white oak trees. From my granddad always taught me about oak trees. Um, I look for um the the tracks, I remember, you know, just old rubs from years back, you know. Usually, you know, if you find old rubs from years back, usually that's tradition carried on from another buck will come through a lot of times, and then a lot of times from crows, man. Crows sometimes or blue jays um love acorns, man. And you hear a lot of blue jays around, and you just got to kind of listen for that sound to say, man, it's something's probably down in that area pretty good to feed, some food source or something. And then um, it's not long if you if you play it right, then you'll you'll see a lot of deer. So I always kind of take my time through the woods, look at trees knee high that are nibbled off, you know. Like you'll get you'll get subtle finger. I call them like fingerprints, you know, you get subtle ones, and then you're like, Yeah, they're they're in here browsing. This is a good area. There's white oaks here, this is it, and then it comes from the instincts of doing it for so long, you know. Like what areas that has a bot, you know, you find these ridges, and if you're lucky to get properties that have a bottleneck, that bottleneck is perfect for the rut. Like those those are the ones where you can set up one of your uh fix stands and just only hunt it during the rut, like it's a bottleneck because it because if you get down too much in there, and I've learned this the hard way, your thermals come up, and then it's just the whole area is saturated where you should have been above it the whole time, and you that takes years, you know, to learn. But um, there's nothing I there's nothing beats boots on the ground.

SPEAKER_01 32:43

Yeah, that's so true. I remember I think it was two seasons ago, I did not kill a deer, and I was so like, what did I do wrong? I had skunked. It was my first time in that area. I did some scouting, I was 30 days out. I just got I just moved into the area, and um the sign was everywhere, but I was just not getting anything. And I was talking to one of my buddies, and he asked me what my setup was, and I told him, I was like, Well, I've been using my hang on, and I've also been using my climber, I've been going to this area and that area, and I've noticed that every time I went, I always had wind behind me. I never had it in my face, and so that was always like my downfall. I always ended up getting blown out by these bucks that were coming in the area. Like I would see them, they just never would come in because they would smell me. And it was like, man. But over the years, I started realizing I need to change my game, or over the last two years, I needed to change my game. And then last year I killed like seven or eight deer just because of changing my tactics up a little bit. So this year I hope I I want to repeat that. Um, but if I don't, it's not the end of the world, but I just I'm hunting two different areas this year. I'm going out to uh 4B outfitters out in Oklahoma. I'm looking forward to that, and it's just gonna be like one of those hunts where it's like in the rut, November 6th, and it's game on from that day on, and I can't wait.

SPEAKER_02 34:06

Man, I yeah, we'll have to stay in touch with that. That's you never know what you're gonna run into. A Midwest deer, man. That's a different animal, it's a different animal.

SPEAKER_01 34:15

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_02 34:17

I went out to Kansas and got my ass kicked because I I'd never hunted anything like this. I was like, where are the freaking trees at? Like, yeah, I'm hunting, you know, it's a whole the wind's always blowing, the trees are freaking sideways. And um I got I got my ass kicked, but I learned a lot, you know, and Midwest hunting, man, is is uh no joke, but there's yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:43

When when I went out to Yuma, Arizona for training with some of my buddies and some of our students, our students would go off into the wind, and they would just we would tell them where we need them to go and how they do like conflicts between each other and whatnot. But my buddy John and I would always go out in the middle of nowhere, we'd climb up to the mountains and stuff like that. And you would see these it sounds like a shotgun's going off, and we'd just like look at each other and I was like, that was a ramp. And we would come over this ridgeline, and you could just see them just boom, and I was like, Oh, that is so cool, so real.

SPEAKER_02 35:16

That is so awesome.

SPEAKER_01 35:17

Yeah, and then as soon as I go to pull out my phone to film it, it's done. One's walking away, and I'm like, oh man. So I really wish I was able to actually go out there and hunt, but it's so expensive to get a bighorn, and there's such like a big wait list, and it's just like, oh man, they're all some areas they're protected, some they're not. And I was like, man, that would be that'd be awesome to just go out there and experience that.

SPEAKER_02 35:43

Yeah, I I'm definitely looking, I'm gonna, I want to try it again. And I know um I really want to hunt Iowa, and I have some friends on the team that have some property out there, but Iowa's a draw. You have to put preference points in. It's not like you know, you're hunting here in Virginia over the counter. So I gotta do my due diligence on that part, but um, I'm looking forward to trying to to get out there, man.

SPEAKER_01 36:06

Yeah, for real. Three so yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

I got two or three left to go to Iowa.

SPEAKER_02 36:13

Nice.

SPEAKER_00 36:14

We've been working on it.

SPEAKER_01 36:18

So when it comes to the lessons that you faced from going after kicks, what is something that you took away from this and that you want every hunter to really like understand and and learn from?

SPEAKER_02 36:31

Yeah, so wow. So I I think what every hunter can learn from this is um about the cell, first of all, sell cameras or I'm sorry, cameras, SD, any kind of camera. Um, it's great to use for inventory, but just use it for inventory. Like um, understand that it's not that everything, and you just have to be there. You need you need to get you know your property. You understand the you know, the wind is key, but it's not everything to um getting out. So for me, it's it was you know, I had the obsession of hunting this deer, and I tried to do it as best as I could, and I and I wound up shooting him on a bad wind day that I thought was a bad wind day. So yeah, that's the the lesson that I learned. So I since then, um, like I said, as as um after 2021, um I went back to my roots and then I got more aggressive and I you know helped me with a great deer I got last year, just to go, you know, just go. You know, you have to be there. And I think if you if you hunt if you hunt like a savage, the more times it's a numbers game that's gonna increase your opportunities for that luck to happen and making the most of it.

SPEAKER_01 38:05

Absolutely. There's a lot of experience out there that in my opinion, a lot of younger hunters are scared to ask once. And if I had to think of a piece of advice, it's just like ask a weapon and see what you can get from an experienced hunter. Because like there is gatekeeping nowadays still, but there really isn't. Like everyone wants to see this community succeed, and that's what I really enjoy about this uh community in hunting. It's just absolutely phenomenal to watch everybody cheer each other on, and it's no like bashing. Of course, like we'll we'll be like, oh, you missed, huh? Mm-hmm. Yeah, you did. Oh, you hit a tree, I'm sure. Like we always make fun of each other, but at the end of the day, it's always like, hey man, no matter what, you still got out there, you got after it instead of just sitting on the couch.

SPEAKER_02 38:57

Yeah, man, that's and that's who's in your circle. Now you know it's the social media can is evil, there's evil out there too. And there's people want to see you fail, and there's people that are gonna say stuff, and there's people that are gonna get jealous, and there's gonna there's all types in the world, but the majority, yeah, you're 100% right, man. And and the people I surround myself with, the people that are on my team are like family, and that passion, when someone knocks one down, man, I I get just juiced, man. It's like like you just said, it's awesome, and it just motivates you more, man. Because you know this, man, when it gets when it gets into November and you're in the middle of November and you look on social media, and I think everybody's killed a deer but you, you you look at it and you're like, oh shit, man, what's wrong? And you know, you start grinding, and that's that's that's that's you know what I mean. We've all gone there, and you're just starting to feel like then you you're starting to think wrong, you're starting to look through it at a wrong lens, you're getting sloppy, you're thinking, and then you have to just back up and go, Hey, you know, before the season starts, there's a lot of things, you know. We're starting our we're having our Virginia Road show this Saturday, and then we finish up the 23rd in Iowa. And I always say that Iowa one's like the Daytona 500 of hunting because the season's beginning now. We're getting all our equipment dialed in, you're getting all your archery dialed in, you're you're locking down your properties, you're putting in your food plots if you're lucky to have a food plot, or you're just knocking on doors, getting permission, or finding other areas for your pipeline because every year it changes. There's a data center built, there's a house that's sold, there's a brother who now hunts that you can't hunt. There's so many things that we lose properties. You have to always be inquiring to gain properties to keep, I call it like a business pipeline, but a hunting pipeline going, and then there's your hopefully always have public, and then there's that, and don't don't be scared of hunting public because that's been very good to me over the years as well. Um, to do that and have that edge to say, this is gonna be a three-month deal here. This is October, November, December. This is a three-month, and I'm gonna go at it for these three freaking months like a savage. I've already talked to my wife, me and her have got an agreement. Hopefully, everybody's you know done that and have taken their wives on vacations and stuff and had them all happy for three months. I asked my wife, please don't plan anything, um, as much as you can. Uh, my kids are grown now, so it's awesome. But you know, I've had two kids over the years and I've missed a wedding over deer. I've had some thought I was gonna get a divorce over deer. It's just you know, the obsession hits you um of that animal, but it's it's it's um it's great. But I think if you really go back to the question, if you focus that it's this is a marathon. This I'm not gonna go out day one and kill a deer. If you do, hey man, that's a bonus. But I'm gonna learn on this day. I'm gonna have you know, and I think having you have permission on a property and you can put a fixed stand up, that's perfect. But mobile hunt around it and find other areas where you can just pop in on him and catch him. You know, he didn't expect you to be there, or that the deer, like, what are you doing over here?

SPEAKER_01 42:16

You know, it's like all you just popped in on him, and yeah, it's it's funny when you walk into like a field and all of a sudden you just see them all just like pop up, and you're just like, Oh, sorry to intrude. Like, I didn't mean to bust you guys up, but it's just like, man, sometimes you hit it, hit it, especially like if you're going in for like an evening hunt, and then you just walk in, you just see all the deer just scattering, you're just like, That's it. Yeah, it's like like like I give up. But sometimes you just have to keep at it. That happened to my buddy Rodney last year. He was talking to me about this eight point that he's the elusive eight point. He has never gotten eight point, he's gotten a seven point and a couple of sixes, and he's like, I want this eight point so bad. And I was just sitting in my stand, and finally I hear this, and I was like, please let that be an eight point. And then I hear him just give like that woo in the background. And I was like, I immediately knew that he got what he was after. Hopped out of the stand, hauled down this trail. There's like a video of me. You could see me running with my rifle, like as fast as I can with my pack on through this little trail. And I get up to him and we just embrace in this hug. And he's like, dude, finally, I got it. And I was like, I told you, man, something was different about this. Like, we did a prayer with each other right before we went out to the woods and and went our ways. And he finally got that a point. And I was like, I don't care if I saw a deer at that point. Like, I was like, I wanted him to get that eight so bad. And he finally got it, and it just it made me so happy for him. And I just remember dragging that thing with him, and it was like, This sucks. Like, I was like, Why do you have to shoot him? He was heavy, like, come on. But he was a beautiful deer, and I was very stoked for him.

SPEAKER_02 43:57

Yeah, and y'all just share it together, man. That's yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:04

I think that was our first weekend hunt away ever as uh as friends, so that was even better. And then um he was with me when I killed my first, it was a spike last year. Last year is the first time I killed a deer with my bow, and I've am now addicted to it. And he was there when I killed it, and I was like, You want to help me track it? And he was like, Absolutely. I he hopped out of the stand. I saw him on my cell camp can pop up, and we tracked this thing, went no more than 50 yards using the G5 megamets. That thing just tore through that deer, and I was very happy with it. Like, I don't care if it was a spike, I don't care if it was a dough or whatever. I was just like, I need to get some meat in the freezer. It was the first deer of the season, got him down, and I was like just ecstatic that I was able to actually get a deer with my bow for the first time. And then the confidence after that is what really got me going even harder and even better than ever. I came home practicing, practicing non-stop. Um, I did wound a deer, I felt so bad. That and then that was what made me different from that point on later in the season. Like I was adamant that I will make sure that I can just put the arrow where it needs to go every single time. So, and that's something I think young hunters need to understand too. Like, there's gonna be times where it's gonna be hard, and there's gonna be times where you actually mess up, and at the end of the day, it happens. You might not be able to track them, you might lose them, but it's a learning point. And a lot of people give people too much crap, I feel like, about that stuff. Um, instead of letting them know, like, hey man, it's okay, it happens. It does suck, it's gonna, it's gonna bother you for a little bit. You're probably gonna have a nightmare or two over it. But at the end of the day, all you can do is just put that in the past, learn from your mistakes, and just move, just keep going.

Final Lesson And Closing Thanks

SPEAKER_02 45:56

No, no, you said it right, man. And you do it, you bow hunt long enough, it's gonna happen. Um, a limb, something it you know, Lord knows. But if you do everything and you're like you're saying, if you're practicing your clear eyes when you're in the woods, you're not under a substance. Um, which never absolutely that's a big thing that's forbidden for me at all. Now there's when if I have one on the back of my truck and I'm home, then my wife knows to come on out with some Tito's for me because we celebrate. Um, but until he's he's until he's hanging on my skin and pole, man. There's no I want to be my best, you know, absolutely and the respect the the animal, and then also, like you said, you don't want to live with that regret and just paying that out that's that stinks, man. But that's just uh that's just part of it.

SPEAKER_01 46:47

It is so, but at the end of the day, this wasn't just about a buck named Kix, it was about listening to your gut, even when it doesn't make sense on paper about stepping outside when doubt says stay inside, and sometimes all it takes is just hey, you're not gonna kill him on the couch, and you could have stayed on that couch, but at the end you didn't, and because of that, you were able you walked into a memory that will be with you for a lifetime, and it's gonna go on for others as well because people are gonna share this story, and for every hunter out there waiting on the perfect conditions, just remember the perfect moment may not look perfect at all. You can't kill him sitting on the couch, all right. And and Brian, I just want to say thank you so much for coming on the show today. Sorry for some of the technical difficulties that I had now going on. I don't know what happened, bad connection or whatever, but as you can tell, I had to change change rooms. As you can see, the scenery behind me is completely different. But I just want to say thank you so much for coming on today and sharing the story and diving deeper into the story of Kix.

SPEAKER_02 47:52

No, thank you guys. It's uh it brought back a lot of good memories because you know that's 2019 and um yeah to be able to relive and tell it. Man, I was getting I'm getting like goosebumps over it, man. Because always, like you said, I'll carry it to the grave. And thank you, Zach. Man, it's been uh been a pleasure, man.

SPEAKER_01 48:09

That's awesome, man. I really appreciate everything. Hopefully, next time uh we can have you on again later on this year, and hopefully, you have another story about another deer from the season.

SPEAKER_02 48:18

Fantastic, man. I'm looking forward to hope so too.

SPEAKER_01 48:21

Thanks, all right, guys. Everybody take care, and hopefully, we'll see you next time on uh Echoes of the Hunt Behind the Hunt.

SPEAKER_02 48:28

You got it, man. Hang on, thank you.